Lunchtime Discussion: Superheroes
Is it a bird, is a plane?
Published: 12:00, 24/08/2010 by Kris [Halbpro].
44Here’s a weird fact about my process for writing. I will spend hours coming up with an idea that’s worth discussing, sometimes racking my brains for an entire day. Then, just as I’ve settled on an idea, I’ll go to type the title in and completely change my mind about what I was going to write about. This does have the small downside that I have no idea what I’m going to write about when I actually start but it’s more fun this way. This part of my writing process is exactly what happened today and that is why we’re going to talk about superheroes.
Everyone loves superheroes right? Even if you don’t like comic books there’s some kind of hero that resonates with almost everyone on some level. You might love the simple purity of Superman, the wise cracking antics of Spider-Man, the anti-hero attitude of Wolverine or maybe the insane violence of less traditional ‘heroes’ like Haunt or the Boys appeals to you. Not everyone has an incredibly deep knowledge of these characters, but I would imagine that a very high number of people in the Western world can at least identify cultural touchstones like the Superman or Batman logos.
What I’m not going to say to everyone is go read comics. Sure, comics are where most superheroes are born, but their franchises are so much bigger than any one medium now. Look at the success of films like Iron Man or The Dark Knight to see just how big they are. In fact superheroes are so huge now that Mark Millar, the writer behind Kick Ass, already had film studios bidding on his next project, Nemesis, before the first issue had been released.
Sadly superheroes have always kinda tanked when it comes to games. Sure we’ve had the odd success like Batman: Arkham Asylum or Spider-Man 2 but for the most part they haven’t exactly set the world on fire. I’ve got high hopes for Spider-Man: Shattered Dimensions as well, perhaps we’re moving into some kind of renaissance for superhero games but I seriously doubt it.
It’s hard to understand just why superhero games are generally so bad. We already know the characters, even if it’s only in a vague sense for a lot of people. Given that pre-existing relationship you’d think the games would be better rather than worse but perhaps that’s the issue. When games take a pre-established character we already know what they’re capable of and how they act, so if the game gets it wrong we notice instantly. It’s similar to the issue faced by a lot of sporting games, the in-game sports stars don’t quite match up to their real world counterparts.
What’s your take on superheroes? Would you rather they stayed in comics, or do you like the expansion into films and games? More importantly do you have a favourite?
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24/08/2010 at 12:09
Member since: Aug 2010
Wait until you get to 30+. I used to like superman – no grey area, it was either right or wrong, but eventually the world skews your perspective. No I feel like superman but with the mentality of the Joker.
24/08/2010 at 12:10
Member since: Dec 2009
as long as they keep the Batman games similar to AA i won’t be too unhappy. hoping for a Superman game similar too…
talking of such, i thought DC Universe Online was going to be good but after looking at gameplay vids… well, no. high hopes dashed.
24/08/2010 at 12:18
Member since: May 2009
Batman: Arkham Asylum was magnificent!
I like superheros and comic culture, it’s just a lot of fun.
As for a favourite superhero, I’d probably have to say Batman (although it might be cliche). I don’t get why everyone says “he’s not a superhero, he’s just a rich man”. When was the last time you saw Bill Gates dressing up as a bat and kicking some criminal ass?
24/08/2010 at 14:30
Member since: Aug 2008
The reason he’s not a superhero is because he doesn’t have any super-powers. That is why people say that.
He’s technically an all-action hero in comic book terms. Superheroes have one or more inhuman powers while Batman is a kick arse human but with cool equipment.
24/08/2010 at 15:03
Member since: Feb 2009
you could say the same for iron man, green arrow, hell, green lantern just uses a bit of tech.
booster gold, blue beetle.
there are loads of superheroes with no powers.
24/08/2010 at 22:44
Member since: Aug 2008
No, those are also not superheroes. In the comics that spawned them they are referred to as all-action-heroes or mystery men for the very reason of distinguishing them from super-heroes.
The point is that since they are just mortal men, it’s much easier to make a game work since a lot more normal dangers can be in place.
24/08/2010 at 12:19
Member since: Aug 2009
Superheroes can never get fully right in video games
Spiderman 2 and Batman AA are the best ive played
24/08/2010 at 12:20
Member since: Forever
I think that superheroes should really be born in comic books, but there’s nothing wrong with branching out into other mediums when they’re done right, but there lies the problem. They’re so often NOT done right. There are of course some exceptions (Batman: Arkham Asylum, The Dark Knight, Kick-Ass, Scott Pilgrim etc) but generally the extra products just aren’t on the same level as their usually brilliant source material.
Can they ever reach that level though? The main reason I love reading comic books is the characterisation within them. They seem to go into a lot more back story and really flesh out the characters, where as games and movies generally keep that to a minimum. Now, there’s probably a reason for this, i.e who’d want to watch/play a lengthy “origins” movie/game but for this reason (amongst others), I don’t think comic books will ever be surpassed by their bi-products.
Oh and my favourite “superheroes” are usually the ones without super powers, the ones that are more relatable. Batman would be my choice out of the “classic” superheroes (closely followed by Spidey), but people like Rick Grimes (The Walking Dead) and Scott Pilgrim for example, I think are great because they’re just normal(ish) guys in extraordinary circumstances.
24/08/2010 at 14:07
Member since: Apr 2010
I love The Walking Dead! I would agree with this, the only characters I particularly enjoy are those with strong weaknesses (from their humanity, not from their aversion to kryptonite).
29/08/2010 at 11:53
Member since: Dec 2009
The world needs SH’s!
The Gaming world needs SH’s!
Best games ive ever played are:
1. Maximum Carnage [SNES]
2. Spiderman and the Xmen [SNES]
3. Spiderman 2
4. Batman: Arkham Asylum
My Fave SH’s:
1. Spiderman
2. Ironman
3. Batman
4. Gambit [Xmen]
24/08/2010 at 12:21
Member since: Jul 2009
I have a favourite hero although he is not Marvel nor DC he’s from IMAGE – Spawn I have all the comics 1 – 100 Love it all, I even have the film DVD which was superb (imho) been waiting for a sequel and it has been years :(
The Dark Knight was an amazing film including the Joker was by the best aswell as Two Face. Spiderman was brilliant but the 3rd one was kinda rushed and so was X-Men 3 Last Stand. I used to watch the Hulk T,V series lol good days.
Daredevil and Electra errrr……. wasn’t good :( The Punisher errr Ok! I guess lol.
Michael Keaton’s Batman was Ok too (Was it Tim Burton that did it both I’m sure it was) But George Clooney, Val Kilmer, Big Arnie, Jim Carrey, (although he was almost good reminds me of Adam West Batman) and Tommy Lee Jones – NO! lol it was indeed a kiddie movie :P
So yes comics should involve movies but it will have it’s flaws. Fantastic 4 was good but the Silver Surfer lacked something? Superman Returns for some reason I didn’t like it? I don’t know why. I must be a batman material.
24/08/2010 at 15:18
Member since: Mar 2009
Spawn is amazing, i also like the relatively new comic Haunt, as for another movie well there is one in the works its currently getting written but it will be a reboot not a sequel
24/08/2010 at 12:23
Member since: Aug 2008
While Batman: Arkham Asylum was a great game, the danger of another Superman 64 – not just a bad superhero-based game, but a downright terrible game on the whole – leads me to believe that superheroes should do the world a favour and stay out of games.
24/08/2010 at 14:37
Member since: Aug 2008
Superman 64 was a infamously bad game but come on, we can’t just look at that and say “no, the risk is too great, lets not make any more superhero games”. Every mistake is a lesson for the future
24/08/2010 at 15:58
Member since: Aug 2008
Infamously bad? It was such an awful piece of sh- um, piece of software, that it sent shockwaves of crappiness through time and space forever tainting games based on superheroes. Like E.T. did for film tie-ins.
I agree that mistakes should be learnt from, but in this case… who has? A tidal wave of pap has been spawned. Iron Man, Fantastic Four, The Incredible Hulk, Spider Man – have all been thoughtlessly crammed into a bad games. Comicbooks, films – they’re both perfectly acceptable – but it seems as though as soon as an element of interactivity is introduced, and we can no longer get by on having our imagination fill in the gaps, that the world of the superhero falls apart.
24/08/2010 at 12:26
Member since: Forever
A lot of people like Batman AA, but I thought it was weak.
It was repetitive as hell, with some of the worst AI I’ve seen since the 8bit days, with enemies following a pre-determined path like a bad LBP level. However I can see how the dark presentation of the game and a great depiction of Batman & Joker would please fans, I just felt as a game (taking the two characters out of it) it was lacking more than it had.
Scott Pilgrim is a great game, although not a superhero perhaps shines a light on how best to tackle adding Superheroes to games.
Spiderman Vs The Kingpin on the Megadrive was the best superhero game I’ve played.
24/08/2010 at 12:40
Member since: Dec 2008
With the Scott Pilgrim game, I don’t know why they had to add the retro look, think it would have been awesome with shiny HD graphics (I’d even keep the soundtrack). Graphics are a little offputting for my liking, and I did really like it. I just don’t think it needed that nostalgic touch. Maybe I missed the point of it.
24/08/2010 at 14:42
Member since: Aug 2008
I agree. It felt like a cheeky way to save development time and write it up as a feature. It didn’t add anything and after the demo my eyes hurt a bit.
24/08/2010 at 14:50
Member since: Forever
I thought it made a change (and a good one) to the wealth of games which have the added HD-gloss.
It seemed to focus on good old fashioned fun and playability rather than pixel count, even though the ‘retro look’ was probably harder to achieve
24/08/2010 at 22:45
Member since: Aug 2008
Normally I applaud original design and retro can work really well (dot game heroes for example) but I just didn’t think it did in that game.
24/08/2010 at 12:32
Member since: Apr 2009
Some of the Apple fanboys regard Steve Jobs as a Superhero. How about someone including him in a game – maybe where you can shoot Apple fanboys multiple times (lots of fun there!) before assulting the Big Boss by uploading a virus with a Windows 7 laptop (a bit like Independence Day)…
24/08/2010 at 12:33
Member since: Mar 2009
Superheroes should definetly continue to appear in games. But as with movies, they are hit by lazy devs looking to cash in and/or not being passionate about the subject matter. Rocksteady proved this isnt always the case, and produced something gamers and Batman fans could enjoy. Problem is I’m guessing they have set a bar that many other devs will just ignore.
Although not a superhero, I really enjoyed Rogue Troope on the PC (havent played the Wii port, but hoping for a move version), which i thought was another strong transition from comic book to game.
Heres hoping more games treat comics and their heroes with a bit more care. And also hope someone does a Grendel game, which has to be my fave comic series of all time.