Guerrilla Games: “Haven’t Hit The Limit”
Still some room for that PS3 to flex, then.Published 18/03/2010 at 9:00.
By Alex C [nofi].
Killzone 2 Marathon Boot [36]
Honey, I’m Home! [33]
Killzone 2 Wins Ivor Novello Award [12]
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TSA King of Killzone Participants [13]
Killzone 2 was a technical masterpiece, a fact further exaggerated by the stunning interactive (and free) realtime graphics demo that was released onto the PSN Store a little after the game’s release.
However, it appears that Guerrilla Games still reckon there’s some room for improvement. “We’re satisfied that we demonstrated the potential of the hardware,” said Hermen Hylst, Co-founder of the studio talking to Edge this month.
“But we realise that further optimisations are always possible and that we haven’t hit the limit yet.” Developers are always coming up with lines like this, but when it’s Guerrilla, we listen.
Rumours of a Killzone 3 reveal soon and a release for the third game next April have been circulating across the internet recently. We asked Sony about the rumours, but received the “we don’t comment on rumours” line.
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bunimomike | 18/03/2010 09:04
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Resident Evil 4 was a good example of how people can produce some jaw-dropping graphics on hardware that’s allegedly found its ceiling (on the PS2). Makes sense that the developers of things like UC2 and KZ2 are seeing how code can be optimised even further. Top stuff.
illogicology | 18/03/2010 09:06
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I wish these developers shouting about how far they can push the PS3 would spend a little of that energy getting the basics like anisotropic filtering, anti-aliasing and 1080p right.
bunimomike | 18/03/2010 09:13
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I love my 1080p TV but is it a real hardware hit for game development? It strikes me that 720p is extremely presentable and 1080p only ups the quality by a semi-decent level as compared to going from SD to 720p. Pixar films, like Ratatouille, look divine in 1080p but they’re not a million miles off in 720p either. Is the trade-off worth it, is what I’m trying to ask. :D Keep in mind the wealth of people who don’t have 1080p sets.
illogicology | 18/03/2010 09:30
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Well, I think it’s game dependent certainly. Killzone 2 actually has one of the best looks at 720p because so much effort has gone into producing a sharp 1080p. It has one of the best uses of Quincunx Anti-Aliasing I’ve ever seen, QAA normally muddies the textures but Killzone 2 has this delightful soft focus look anyway. However, I’d be much happier if they said “Killzone 2 looks great, for Killzone 3 we’re going to take that same level of visual quality and make it run at 1080p” than “We’re going to invent some whistles and bells that will look great on a trailer but not really change the game.” Still, Guerilla are years ahead of the worst offenders.
It’s not really a matter of needing 1080p, the things I listed are just areas I think developers should be spending more effort rather than pushing more polygons and particles. I certainly don’t expect to see all three at once but I really think if you’re not putting out at 1080p, more effort needs to be going into anti-aliasing than we’re currently seeing. Case in point, Uncharted 2. A great, beautiful, fun game that looked incredible but I think the overall visual presentation would have been better if they’d trimmed something from the engine and bumped the 2XAA up to 4X.
I guess what I’m saying is that I’d rather developers were spending a more time getting the basics right.
illogicology | 18/03/2010 09:31
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sorry, that should say “a sharp 720p”
too many numbers floating around my head.
bunimomike | 18/03/2010 10:18
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That’s ok, fella. I wasn’t pulling you up on it too much. Completely agree about them focussing on the basics too. Equally wish Sony would do the same instead of pushing new hardware (3DTV) but I understand why they’re doing that.
.
If games didn’t look any better than UC2 I’d be fine. I just want all games to look this good. Naughty Dog need to take their dev-team on the road and visit all the major studios around the world and introduce them to “10 Ways to Create Stunning Games on the PS3″. :D
jayboy31 | 18/03/2010 11:27
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I don’t actually understand most of the above comments but I do know what looks nice, KZ2, Uncharted 2 & Battlefield 2 all look nice, but where as the first 2 move nice too, BF2 doesn’t. So if they could concentrate more on that sort of thing (think its frame rate?) it would make a lot more difference to the player than shiny graphics
illogicology | 18/03/2010 11:53
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Precisely my point.
ryman102990 | 18/03/2010 13:20
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killzone 2 isn’t in 1080p… it’s 1080i
Kitch | 18/03/2010 10:03
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I think Crysis 2 will push the ps3. Looking at some of the tech demos them guys were doing on Sony’s box of wonders still makes my head hurt.
aphex187 | 18/03/2010 10:05
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Correct me if i’m wrong but i’m sure i heard from a specialist retailer that we will never really see a true 1080p game any time soon.
bunimomike | 18/03/2010 10:19
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Isn’t Wipeout top to toe in Sunday best? (read: 1080p) Equally, the visuals are shiny-slick as oppose to a smaller PSN title with no polygons or 3D graphics.
Raen | 18/03/2010 10:19
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No offence, but retailers are not the people to make that call, they just don’t have the knowledge. Only devs have that kind of knowledge.
illogicology | 18/03/2010 10:28
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The first Marvel: Ultimate Alliance runs at 1920X1080, it is one of the very few to do so but to be fair it both looks like shit and barely manages 20fps consistently.
Ridge Racer 7 is also full 1920×1080, runs like a dream but has fairly modest graphics. Oh, it’s awful too.
retro_ | 18/03/2010 11:37
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I wouldn’t describe RR7 as awful? If it ran at 720p or less and had screen tear then yes, it would be awful but you’ve got to admit that its as smooth as swiss chocolate.
illogicology | 18/03/2010 11:53
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Yep, it was just a really bad game.
cc_star | 18/03/2010 10:24
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GT5 is natively 1080p, so not only are the graphics amongst the best in the world, but they’re doing so at the top notch resolution.
Of course not every developer can afford 5 years of dev time
bunimomike | 18/03/2010 10:31
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Have they managed to get everything running on 1080p or are they using the smoke and mirrors approach mentioned months ago where some stuff does and some stuff doesn’t.
aphex187 | 18/03/2010 10:31
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Well the guy in question has contacts with Gaming magazines that’s all and yeah i know what you mean by not believing!
Also on the point of Wipeout being true 1080p, i thought that was debunked as again it wasn’t running in full true 1080p? or was i dreaming that haha!!
cheers for the replies anyway guys ;)
p.s. Forgot to say that i’m hyped for KZ3 if it is indeed in the works, IMO KZ2 was one of the finest MP gaming experiences i have had if a bit manic at times!
cc_star | 18/03/2010 10:35
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WipEout HD runs at full 1080p and 60fps, however when there is too much going on rather than drop frames it selectively reduces the resolution of some parts of whats being displayed – its all done in an impossible to notice way – quite cool really
bunimomike | 18/03/2010 10:45
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Credit given, that’s a stunningly clever way to nip and tuck when the time’s required.
illogicology | 18/03/2010 10:50
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On the subject of GT5, Prologue ran at full 1920×1080 in game while menus/garage etc. dropped to 1280×1080. Seemed like a reasonable choice to me, I suppose there’s no real need for any of the menus to push the resolution.
Wipeout’s dynamic drop is also to 1280×1080, that’s about 700,000 pixels less than full 1080p and only 100,000 more than 720p. However, the visual improvement over 720p is still more obvious than the drop from 1080. It makes me wonder why more developers don’t push for 1280×1080, it’s a decent increase without too much of a knock to performance and it would also scale to 1080i with the PS3′s gimped, horizontal only scaler for CRT HDTV users. Currently 1080i/p forcing modes are using 960×1080 which looks horrendous, the performance knock of an extra 300,000 pixels must be worth it for a superior picture for most users.
bunimomike | 18/03/2010 10:58
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and there’s the rub. Is the trade-off worth it? Personally, I’d take an even lower resolution if it meant the graphics themselves were utterly incredible with lifelike qualities.
illogicology | 18/03/2010 11:08
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If it means the end of jaggies, I’m all for it. We have two very good ways of killing jaggies in games, increasing the resolution or adding anti-aliasing, that most PS3 games don’t do either is a issue, I think.
Roynaldo | 18/03/2010 11:43
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Funnily enough I was talking a little about the improvements they might make to KZ3 with colin and spoofer last night.
I dont think graphically it needs improving. Only online stability in very certain aspects (if I shoot you in the head, you should be dead). It would be nice to have a few mre bits and bobs aswell, but not to the point of MW2 where it seems to have gone OTT with unlockables and stuff.
Im looking forward to official news on the new game. Cant wait!
sandeep.lakshmanan | 18/03/2010 12:03
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A little bit of tweaking may be possible. But not to a great extent. Having played KZ2 its apparent that many a times the PS3 engine was found wanting for more power and a lot of times you could feel the lag in gameplay as a result of a lack of processing power. May be other system bottlenecks as well. Nevertheless a great game and one of the best FPS out there on PS3. One of my all time favourites.
SIR-DARK-HAZE | 18/03/2010 12:09
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calactyte | 18/03/2010 13:19
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1080p in my opinion would be a major waste of resources. If we’re talking strictly about graphical improvements here, then I’d much rather see the frame rate increased to 60fps. This graphical improvement would also improve the game play sluggishness that many people who come from COD refer to.
I’d also like smoother animation for the motion captured non-playable characters. Sometimes they’d sort of pop in and out of their animations instead of making a nice smooth transition.(COD MW2 does it almost flawlessly)
I’d like true global illumination with color bleeding and bounced light and a better dynamic shadow filter(no pixelation). I’d much rather have more polygon’s pushed rather than a higher resolution.
I thought the anti-aliasing was great. I wouldn’t mind having a texture resolution bump. I think the characters could use a bit more detail, like the high frequency detail maps(KZ3 should definately have it since they mentioned in the PSN demo) that will add tiny details such as cloth fibers to clothing. It’ll all really help to sell the world.
KZ2 had some of the most amazing volumetric smoke ever seen on a game console, it’d be cool if it were improved even more.
Lastly, I’d like to see more detailed normal maps for the environments which should really sell their realism. It’ll be interesting to see what they can do. I believe since the release of KZ2 there is now an extra 70MB free from use by the operating system. I wonder how that will translate into pushing the graphics to the limit.
StevenHibs | 18/03/2010 13:23
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we really need a true 1080p game, I really hope the next Killzone title is just that.
Ryan22 | 31/03/2010 06:56
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OMG! Are you guys forgetting the greatest True 1080p game on Ps3? Metal Gear Solid 4 Guns Of The Patriots. Truly one of the Greatest looking games of our time. Top 3 looking games on ps3 including KillZone 2 & Uncharted 2. which looks better? only god knows, my pick….K2. But MGS4 can do True 1080p, not that upscale crap either, im Talkin The real Deal